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PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2015 4:09 pm 
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Hey folks,

I've got a quick question about impenetrable armor. I thought it was the value under which armor could not be *modified*. However, several excerpts from HotSS and the Mishima army list mention weapons against which "armor saves can not be made, and successful impenetrable armor must be rerolled." This obviously implies that you may take impenetrable armor saves against those weapons which also state that no armor saves may be made.

So, is this true for all weapons which ignore armor? Imperial gas weapons for example. Can models with an impenetrable armor value still take their impenetrable saves against this? I assumed that it was the value under which armor could not be reduced, but that a weapon which *ignores* armor still bypassed. Could anyone clear this up?

Similarly, flame templates targeting models in cover halve your armor. I assume impenetrable armor is also immune to this, no?

Thanks!


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PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2015 2:58 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2015 11:08 pm
Posts: 28
P. 3 of the errata doc says:

Page 45
Change from:
Unless otherwise specified, if an attack states
that no Armour test can be taken, then the
model cannot make any Armour test against
this attack, regardless of whether it has Impenetrable
armour or not.
TO
Unless otherwise specified, if an attack states that
no Armour test can be taken, then the model cannot
make any Armour test against this attack. If
no armour test may be taken, and the model has
an impenetrable armour value, the model may
roll on its impenetrable armour value.

As far as I know you wouldn't halve their impenetrable armor value for FT weapons in cover either. Halve their full A then if the Impenetrable Armor is higher, use it instead.


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PostPosted: Thu May 07, 2015 9:00 am 
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and about Golgotha special skill that halves model armor?

impenetrable armor still cant be halved?


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2015 4:25 am 
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Unless the rule specifically mentions Impent Armor it cannot be altered. The rerolls far as i know is the extent of the rules that affect it, outside the obvious and imho too strong Power Shot (as it was also faq'd to include impent armor)


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2015 7:57 am 
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correct. Impenetrable armour cannot be halved.

However, it should be noted that two types of attacks aren't made against armour at all, so IA is irrelevant. Psychic (S) attacks are against WP, and Gas is against CON. Therefore, IA won't save you in those cases.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2015 2:28 pm 
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As long as the Imperial rules are in beta, IA protects you from gas, since you may not roll armor and as Darth_Fraggle said:

"Unless otherwise specified, if an attack states that no Armour test can be taken, then the model cannot make any Armour test against this attack. If no armour test may be taken, and the model has an impenetrable armour value, the model may roll on its impenetrable armour value."

So its: Con test->Impenetrable Armor test->Heal test->Wound

Now if gas starts to ignore IA, hooray for Imperial players.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2015 11:54 pm 
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Looking forward for that Imperial PDF update if it is indeed suppose to ignore Invul Armor, because right now i hate gas except against troops (and useless against brotherhood troops sporting shields since for some reason they have an invul period with those shields, rather than melee only like every other troop that gets an invul somehow)

Since it mentions armor saves that leads you to believe you can use IA with the current Errata. Even though i find it completely on par with normal flamers when they do ignore IA because they attack less, but only a handful of units actually have good odds of surviving it.

Edit: Also sorry about sounding strict in any of my posts. Im a Warhammer 40k player and im used to bashing rules into peoples faces just to get a fair game because they keep trying to ignore major rules or use a rule in the completely wrong fashion. Usually shaft myself more than my opponent in doing so lol but i prefer a fair match/challenge, not a steamroll.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2015 4:57 pm 
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ADG_Wraith wrote:
correct. Impenetrable armour cannot be halved.

However, it should be noted that two types of attacks aren't made against armour at all, so IA is irrelevant. Psychic (S) attacks are against WP, and Gas is against CON. Therefore, IA won't save you in those cases.


I am not sure this is the case! Gas weapons still say "the model receives a would effect with no armor saves allowed."

The main book says that if no armor test can be made against a wound effect, unless the attack states otherwise, impen armor can still be taken.

So yes, gas is against con, but it's still a wound effect. This is in contrast to the Iron Lady's med tools, Diana's ccw, and crimson devils' grenades which either state that the target simply loses a wound for each failed con test, or specifically mentions that impen armor is affected. Similarly, psychic attacks specifically state that impen armor is ignored.

I wish Prodos would take a page out of Spartan Games' book and have some folks address rules concerns online! I love Warzone and it's slowly making a resurgence in our store, but there's still a bunch of awkwardly worded rules!


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2015 10:54 am 
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Rules concerns were being addressed on Facebook for a while, but the issue is that the rulings quickly got lost in a monster thread. The best way is an official FAQ/Errata that will be available to everyone.

To Prodos' credit, every time a new errata comes out, they update the main rules. However, the FAQ is missing in action!


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2015 2:36 am 
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New Imperial book specifically states that gas ignores impen armor.

Problem solved!


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