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PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2015 3:22 pm 
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Posts: 67
If a model is on sentry and an enemy model is in his LOS the sentry can perform a shooting action between the activation
or actions of an enemy model.

Let's say a smart gunner is on sentry while three stalkers are waiting down the corridor behind a corner of a crossing.

Sketch:

empty crossing tile / empty corridor tile / corridor tile with smart gunner on sentry
/
corridor tile with
three stalkers

1. The alien player activates an alien stalker with a running action and enters the LOS of the smart gunner
by moving onto the crossing tile. The marine player reacts by using a shooting action.
He rolls well and sends the stalker to oblivion with the first shot of three possible.
This ends the action of the smart gunner and the turn of the Alien player.

(Or: Does the smart gunner have to wait for the stalker performing his complete running action of 3 moves and shoot after that?
The rules speak of using sentry "between actions" not between single steps of an action.
So, following the rules word by word the stalker would run to the smart gunner and engage him. In this case the smart gunner
wouldn't be able to shoot the stalker because he is engaged before he can perform his sentry action. Not good.)

2. Marine player is on and performs an action with another model somewhere else on the board.

3. Predator player is on and performs an action with a model somewhere else on the board.

4. The alien player is on again and activates his second stalker with a running action to the tile of the smart gunner
and again entering the LOS of the smart gunner. What happens?

a) Is the sentry action completely through by shooting the first stalker in 1. and the second stalker engages the smart gunner?
This rule would be quite bad for using sentry guns - only able to shoot a single stalker and then being overrun by the second one.

b) Can the smart gunner use the two remaining shots of his ROA of 3 to shoot the second stalker? And when is he able to shoot exactly - one shot per tile of the stalker movement? How is this processed in the game? Does the alien player has to remember all his remaining shots of all models?


Last edited by Deadcat on Wed Sep 02, 2015 5:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2015 4:31 pm 
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Deadcat wrote:
a) Is the sentry action completely through by shooting the first stalker in 1. and the second stalker engages the smart gunner?


Yes, cause in Sentry mode you only get 1 action left, in reaction.
This action can be used between two ennemy's actions (not to interrupt an action)

Deadcat wrote:
This rule would be quite bad for using sentry guns - only able to shoot a single stalker and then being overrun by the second one.

b) Can the smart gunner use the two remaining shots of his ROA of 3 to shoot the second stalker? And when is he able to shoot exactly - one shot per tile of the stalker movement? How is this processed in the game? Does the alien player has to remember all his remaining shots of all models?


In your configuration i'll use "Tactical Move" to be the first one to shoot (but i'll be abble to shoot only the first stalker), or i'll use my last action with the support of my "Motion Sensor Marine" (in this case i'm abble to spend my 3 ROA on Stalkers)


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2015 5:07 pm 
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Tactical Move only works faster against enemy models using a sentry action themselves.
Read the rules on page 24.

And if the smart gunner is two tiles away from the crossing making a Tactical Move he is still
one tile away from the crossing and can not shoot because he has no LOS around the corner.
So there is no possibility to shoot before the run action because he has only Los AFTER the run.

Assisting motion tracker marines work only with flame throwers, not with rifles or smart guns.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2015 10:32 am 
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I'm kind of lost in your example...

- "his complete running action of 3 moves" = seems impossible. Stalkers run 2 tiles (1+1). What am I missing here?
- There's no way an Alien can take down the Sentry in this game turn. Even if they run into the tile, they can't CC since they have no actions left.
- The Marine player can just keep the Sentry action unused until later, and Shoot at the end of the turn, when he will know where all Aliens are. He might be able to use his RoA 4 to take down more Aliens.

Right? I know I haven't had coffee yet, but I can't see what I'm missing.

It seems to me the best the Alien player can do is run and pray. If any Alien survives then on the next turn he can move+CC into the Sentry. Getting shot at again by the Sentry.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2015 12:27 pm 
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@ montanhas:
You are missing that Alien Stalkers have a running speed of 3 because they get an additional +1 for Hive Bloodhounds ( P ) on page 35.
So if you wait until end of turn the stalkers would all end their move action on the tile of the smart gunner/sentry gun and he/it would get the -10 for shooting.

Btw: there is no way to use Tactical Advance in my example because the smart gunner was already activated, otherwise he wouldn't be able to be on sentry.
Maybe before his turn he was one tile behind (3 spaces away from the crossing).

Did you play a 3-player-szenario yet?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2015 4:36 pm 
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Thanks, I had missed the Bloodhounds thingy.

I totally misread your first post, actually. Sorry. I read "Sentry Gun" instead of "smartgunner".

Nevermind.

In that case, yes, I guess you shoot the first Stalker. It makes sense.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2015 6:08 pm 
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I think the smart gunner isn't that much of a difference to the sentry gun. The difference of the two weapons is just the ROA of 3 and 4.

And thanks for trying to understand my example.

The game leads quite often to complicated situations.
But I like that. It's a feature of highly tactical games.

My critique with this point leads to a difference between what is reality in the game and the reality I know from the films.
In the films smart gunners and sentry guns rock the house, mowing down hordes of enemies.
In the game it kills 1 or 2 before it is overrun.

So in a few but important points the game doesn't reproduce the feeling of the Alien Universe. But I think it should!


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 10:01 am 
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Sentry Guns have "Auto-Sentry (P)". Ie, they go into Sentry at the start of the Game Turn. So the Alien player can't use his first activation, assuming he goes before the Marine player, to engage the Gun without getting shot. So that would be different.

Yeah, your example doesn't match well with the movies. As an aside, I don't like the Sentry Gun "movement" rule for that same reason. I don't remember Sentry Guns being deployed with Power Loaders in the movies :) I think I'll try to house rule to be moved by any marine model...


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 4:30 pm 
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The sentry guns will go after the alien activation if the alien starts out of LoS. This means placement of sentry guns will be very tricky to pull off effectively. Im not sure they will be worth 35pts in the board game at all to be honest. As the sentry rules stand im not sure i will now buy any sentry guns at all for these reasons:

1) you must have at least a two tile distance from a blind corner to get your shots off or your engaged every time.

2) you must have a power loader to place them anywhere else but your start points.

Prodos need to seriously clear up the sentry gun rules or sales will be hampered drastically.
For the moment im gonna leave em alone.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 8:08 pm 
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Good point about sentry guns.
In the film they had a big suitcase for every gun and put up two sentry guns with two marines each.
Those suitcases were placed atop the seats in the APC. How do you get them out there with a power loader? It's ridiculous.

Perhaps the author of the board game didn't watch the the second film's directors cut??? :shock:


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